Virginia House of Delegates 2005 Elections

Keeping You up to date on the status of Virginia's 2005 Delegate races!

Wednesday, May 11, 2005

Change of Rating in the 45th

We had previously rated the 45th District primary as a "Toss Up. Leans Garvey or Englin. Slight lean to Garvey between them. Candidate to watch: Mandala."

Laura Mandala who leads the money race has gone on the attack with Libby Garvey. Mandala has mailed, and is telling the press that Garvey is to blame for a major cost overrun at the new Arlington County High School. This could be a major issue on two fronts. One is obvious, with Garvey's experience as an elected official questioned, that will hurt her efforts as the "most experienced". Also, this could hurt most in Arlington County, a small part of the 45th, but absolutely crucial to Garvey.

While Englin made a mistake in his mailings that we noted last week, this could be his chance to take a clear lead in the primary. With this all out catfight breaking out between Mandala and Garvey, Englin needs to lay back and let everyone watch. For now, we are calling this a three way tossup between Englin, Garvey and Mandala, with one caveat. Englin and Garvey will be near the leaderboard on election night, Mandala could beat them both by a lot, or lose by a lot. She is a real wild card right now with the most money and the most negative campaign.


At 11:43 PM, Anonymous roanoker said...

I like them all. Any one interested in running in Roanoke if you don't make it?

At 12:18 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Money Mandala's glass house is going to be busted in on her - she's the candidate who's renting an apartment in a district she doesn't live in, robocalling weekly people who no longer live in the district, and now decides to let the world see what a world-class (*&( she is by letting loose on Garvey. If Englin's smart he'll let them take each other down.

At 10:23 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

The Englin's will do anything to win this seat. Watch out.

At 10:47 AM, Blogger Shayna Englin said...

Ha! Um...thanks, I guess, anonymous.

Just to be clear: though we're absolutely certain David is the best candidate in this race, there are in fact limits to what we'll do to win a seat in the VA House of Delegates.

We won't, for example, rent an apartment in a neighboring district just so we can run there. We won't spend Caleb's college fund. We won't steal other candidates' ideas and language and try to pass them off as our own. We won't engage in a mutual destruction pact with Mandala, Garvey, or anyone else (but I'd be lying if I said it won't be just a little amusing to watch Mandala and Garvey do it).

What we will do: contintue to be the campaign that energizes the most volunteers and voters with a strong, progressive message, fresh ideas, and a genuine commitment to building the party.

At 11:28 AM, Anonymous Kevin Beekman said...

'Not Larry': It's all well and good to post supposed campaign news while remaining anonymous, but you've alluded to two specific sources for these comments on Laura Mandala going negative.

If this were indeed true, you should be able to produce the mailings or press reports that you allude to. Can we please see a specific reference?

Ms. Englin: Your posts have been full of innuendo and negativity. If you have something to say, please say it publicly rather than in the shadows of obscure blogs of questionable integrity. Maybe then we can have a full discussion of what exactly is and isn't party building.

At 12:02 PM, Blogger Shayna Englin said...

Mr. Beekman - I certainly didn't mean to be negative and would LOVE to have a discussion of what is and isn't party building.

You start: what do you think?

At 12:22 PM, Blogger Shayna Englin said...

Also for Mr. Beekman - if you'd rather not discuss it on the blog, you're welcome to email or call me directly. or 703-549-3203 (the campaign line).

At 12:32 PM, Anonymous Kevin Beekman said...

Ms. Englin: Well, this is not exactly a public forum, but I think you did mean to go negative as this certainly isn't the first posting that you've made that is an ad hominen attack on Laura's character. It is disingenious of you to claim otherwise. I think you have sought out postings of innuendo on the blogs and attempted to capitalize on them without any regard to the veracity of the claims being made. And you've tried to use this tactic to drive a wedge among those inclined to vote in the democratic primary in the 45th.

In the end, when the primary is over, regardless of whether there's a republican challenger or not, the local party is going to have to come together behind a candidate.

Further, I think that candidate, to be effective as delegate is going to have to know the meaning of rapprochement in order to work in Richmond. I think one's campaign is an indication of to what extent that is possible.

But this is not the forum to have this discussion, whether you like it or not. These discussion are meant for the clear light of day where reputable people say what they mean and stand up behind their words. Forthrightness is the only way to build the party, because each and everytime that you lurk in the shadows to cast aspersions or perpetuate an innuendo, you're inviting derision on yourself as well as other.

Yes, let's have a discussion. Let's have it in a real public forum. Please,let's hear you tell everyone what you really think. Please, repeat everywhere and to everyone. Let's hear you say it when you go door to door or when you call voters on the phone. Let's see you post in on your signs. Write it in the papers. Say it at the forums. Put it in your literature and I'll even volunteer to drop it door to door.

If you're only willing to say something only in certain venues, then they aren't worth saying.

At 12:40 PM, Anonymous Kevin Beekman said...

Ms Englin: I have no desire to discus this or any matter with you any further. What you do, how you act, how your campaign proceeds, it is up to you.

At 1:19 PM, Blogger Maura in VA said...

"Lurk in the shadows"? That's pretty silly. This is INDEED a public forum - albeit one that is frequented only by a small number of us crazy folk who are this consumed by political discussions. :-)

The irony is, this is a forum which allows people to post anonymously. If Shayna was really interested in "lurking in thh shadows" to "cast aspersions", she could quite easily do so anonymously.

But she doesn't. Shayna has the integrity to post here under her own name, with frankness, sincerity, and a great sense of humor. She engages with both supporters and critics with respect. Netroots outreach has been an effective part of the Englin campaign, bringing in volunteers and demonstrating his eagerness to interact with future constituents and ordinary Virginians.

Many candidates make the mistake of thinking that leadership begins after they win. David and Shayna know that leadership is also in the running, and they're demonstrating it every day.

At 1:53 PM, Anonymous Not Larry Sabato said...

I'm off location today- so I am posting this from afar- but I echo Maura's thoughts. I dont think Ms. Englin lurked in any shadows, and I find her perspective to be worthwhile. More thoughts when I get some time.

PS- One other thing. Maura made the point this is just a few of us that like discussing. That's true, although on google or yahoo, when you search for candidates our site is starting to hit high, so voters will see this. We are being careful to be fair.

At 1:58 PM, Blogger Shayna Englin said...

Wow - thanks, Maura!

Mr. Beekman - I think it's important to remember that I'm not a candidate. I have no campaign. In every forum I've been - here, and in the one or two places I've been a "surrogate" for David - I've been completely up front about my opinions. Much to the chagrin of David's campaign staff - sorry, Mara and Stephen!

I put my name on my comments and stand behind them. I'm an independent person as is David - we agree on many things and disagree on some things. The best thing for David's campaign literature is his vision for the future of VA. I wouldn't expect Laura's boyfriend, Garvey's husband, or anyone else in the race to distribute to voters their opinions of me - it's an odd suggestion that David's campaign literature should consist of my opinions of other candidates and campaigns.

I say what I think in the venues that are appropriate for an independent person passionately invested in the future of Democratic politics. Blogs certainly count.

At 2:38 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Shayna- You are a good person. We all see that.

At 3:34 PM, Anonymous Frank said...

I've watched this campaign with interest and am very impressed with how Englin has managed his campaign and gotten so many volunteers motivated. A candidate who bad mouths other candidates would not inspire this kind of positive energy or this kind of loyalty. David is not looking to trample other candidates with negativity to get ahead. He is busy reaching out and defining his agenda, not in contrast with other candidates but through his vision for the future of the Democratic party. He is the frontrunner and the others are trying to knock each other out of the way to catch up. Keep your eyes forward, David & Shayna. The finish line is in sight.

At 7:53 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

What is going on here? Why are the Democratic campaigns in the 45th going after each other? This is CRAZY!! Can't we stick together as a party and focus on the issues?

These nasty comments have to stop - from all sides. And, Shayna, I'd like it to begin with you.

Take the high road, PLEASE!! Stop walking on the low road. Keep your comments about the other candidates to yourself. It doesn't do you any favors to post them here or anywhere else. Be a consensus builder, not a divider!! You're starting to anger those who honestly can't decide which way they're going to vote (like me).

Let's focus on the issues and stop bad-mouthing the others!! And when I see "real evidence" that Mandala and Garvey are pulling this trick, I'll say the same thing to them.

Granted, you aren't the candidate. But you're the candidate's wife. Do him a favor and stop this negativity!!

At 10:43 PM, Blogger Not Larry Sabato said...

I'm not going to tolerate that. It's over the line, and deleted. I apologize to anyone who read that.

At 11:53 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

While I have great respect for David Englin's campaign and were I a 45th district resident, would be casting my vote for him on June 14th, I must agree that some of Ms. Englin's comments have bothered me. While I agree with her in substance, as a self-described surrogate of the campaign, her voice IS therefore a voice of the campaign and I would prefer to see a less negative approach to other candidates. Let their actions speak for themselves, just as David's have for his campaign.

At 11:54 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Also - Ms. Englin - I think the name thing is very cool and greatly admire yours and your husband's creativity and lack of adherance to convention.

At 12:23 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I'd like to know 'Not Larry's source for the allegation that Mandala is attacking Garvey in mail and the press with this. If Mandala really is going on the attack, it's a serious and legitimate story.

BTW, I have a lot of respect and admiration for the Englins' relationship. I think it's great that David is the kind of husband who doesn't mind his wife speaking her mind, even if it might not be "on script" for the campaign.

Oh, and I think Kevin Beekman is WAY out of line for questioning this blog's integrity. The author of the blog has no control over the comments, but I think he does a pretty good job with his original reporting.

At 7:54 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Vote for Englin and Byrne! Two places where the women runs the mens lives!

At 9:18 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I'm a neighbor of Laura's in Parkfairfax. I'm voting for Libby. And I have to come to the defense of Shayna Englin. Laura has been badmouthing the candidates to anyone who will listen since she moved in in February. She is the only candidate who has made snide remarks in the debates. Mrs. Englin at least has the honesty to say what she thinks publicly. Laura just talks behind everyone's backs.

At 10:01 AM, Anonymous Tim Smith said...

It's ridiculous that Laura's people would rather attack Mrs. Englin rather than deal with the fact that their candidate is a carpet bagger. I haven't seen anyone here oranywhere else dispute the fact that Laura is renting an apartment in the district, and just started renting early this year, and still owns her actual home in Bryan Moran's district. Laura is an egomaniacal careerist who is perfectly happy letting her boyfriend completely finance her campaign to represent a district that isn't her own. Attacking Englin isn't going to change that.

At 10:18 AM, Blogger Shayna Englin said...

Thanks for the kind words about David and me - I do appreciate it.

I'm exhausted and it shows sometimes. We've got dozens of volunteers in our home every day, plus until the wee hours four nights a week, plus all day Saturdays and Sundays. It's inspiring and exhilerating...and exhausting. I'm also still working full time and working to be a good mom to Caleb. I can definitely own it if I've rubbed anyone the wrong way - my apologies. Thanks for understanding that nerves do get frayed!

We've got just over four weeks to go and we're focused on bringing David's vision for the future of Virginia to the voters across the 45th. If you live in the 45th your door hasn't been knocked on by us, or we haven't called you yet, I look forward to talking to you or having you meet one of our volunteers.

I'm incredibly proud of the campaign we're running, of David for being out front with progressive new ideas that I am certain will make a positive difference for Caleb's and everyone's future in VA, and of the masses of volunteers who've been inspired to get involved.

At 10:18 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

This is an interesting comment. I live in Del Ray and I've heard the same thing about the Englins. I've been told that they are very agressive and have made several off-the-cuff comments about the other candidates, particularly Laura Mandala. Many in Del Ray have been turned off by David Englin and his campaign tactics, especially with his tactic of upstaging other candidate's campaign signs I've been at the Citizen's Association meetings and heard the whispering. You'd think that Del Ray would be solid for David Englin since he lives here, but they're not. There seem to be a lot of Mandala, Hobson and Lay fans here.

At 10:38 AM, Anonymous Laura said...

I'm the Englin's neighbor. There's a sign in my yard and just about every other yard on my block. The same thing is true for the blocks on either side of me. There are dozens of signs in the medians for all of the candidates (a pity, since it litters some of the prettiest drives in the nieghborhood), and you're crazy if you think the Englin signs "upstage" the other signs. If anything, Laura's are the obnoxious ones. They seem to be three times the size of the other candidates'.

Your "whispering' comment makes the point well about who is being up front and who isn't. There's definitely an old guard in Del Ray that hates to see anyone new, and I've also seen those people turn against Englin at the meetings. Which also speaks much better for Englin than for the biddies who hate new people.

At 10:49 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I also live in Del Ray and this is ridiculous. I'd bet dollars to doughnuts that the Englins take their precinct by a landslide. They worked it hard for the Democratic ticket last November and have amazing support here. With the excpetion of Libby, I'd be suprised if the other candidates have as much support in their own precincts.

Thanks for reminding me that I need to stop by the Englin's and pick up my yard sign.

At 10:53 AM, Blogger Not Larry Sabato said...

For those of you that are bashing Shayna- it's very obvious her and David are playing "good cop, bad cop". I think that is smarter then coming on here annonymous and bashing everyone else's candidates.

At 1:36 PM, Anonymous AlexDem said...

Look at it this way- which candidate can be a future asset to our party..

Mandala's boyfriend doesn't have enough $$$ for a statewide campaign

Englin could go statewide, except for his looselipped wife who is not an asset.

Garvey is the perfect future statewide candidate. Great looking, good personality, big quaker vote in the state. Governor Garvey anyone?

At 1:51 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

"great looking"? Are you looking at a different Garvey?

And you forgot to mention: chairs a school board that will go down in the books as making some of the stupidest, most costly decisions anyone could imagine.

Besides, can't imagine a peacenik quaker is going to go very far in VA.

At 1:55 PM, Anonymous Fairlington Parent said...

And now we're back to the real issue - whether Mandala or any of the other candidates will take Libby task for the horrible job she's done on the school board.

The Washington-Lee debacle happened under her watch, and it isn't going to get prettier.

She's running her entire campaign based on her assertion that her experience is the best. Well, if her experience results in mind-blowing screw-ups like Washington-Lee, then she can keep it.

At 2:09 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

OK, now a real debate has started. Is Libby Garvey Hot or Not?

I vote Hot

At 2:15 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I vote Not.

But if Shayna has any class she will vote hot.

At 2:16 PM, Anonymous Tim Smith said...

Anonymous Libby supporter,

"Not an asset"? Are we in the 1950s? Since when is it bad for a wife to have opinions? And what does it say about Libby that her supporters feel about women the way you evidently do?

I've seen the Englins in action and Shayna is absolutely an asset. No other campaign has someone who is effectively a full time volunteer who knows the issues, the candidate, and the area and provides such a welcoming environment for volunteers. Garvey's husband didn't even want her to run. Now's there's "not an asset."

At 2:27 PM, Anonymous Tim Smith said...


At 3:55 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Hot (Kinda)

At 4:37 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Nasty. NOT.

At 4:44 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...


At 6:20 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

totally disagree. fairly hot.

At 6:22 PM, Anonymous Paul said...

Wow. Interesting -

Beekman: Ummm...stop whining. Blogs are public forum, unless you need a password for them.

I don't think Shayna has said anything out of line at any point in any of her comments on here. In fact, she's gone out of the way to be nice...of course you're always going to be able to detect a LITTLE animosity towards the other candidates...but that's politics...We're human. When we face competition, even from people we like and respect, we get...competitive. Everybody lay off.

Strategically, Shayna going on here is brilliant. In an open primary strong dem seat, any forum where a campaign can reach out to activists (see: the blogs and the internet) is a plus. She's getting the Englin name out to activists. The internet is not for winning votes - but you can sure as hell find volunteers.

Another issue - Beekman said, "We should all come together after the primary". Huh? Who cares if we come together. It's an open seat. Who ever wins this will have it UNTIL THEY DIE or RETIRE. People will slowly but surely GET OVER IT. Unless you elect a turkey, in which case: YOU'LL STILL BE StUCK WITH THEM.

At 6:41 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Paul- you think libby is hot? I saw that annon post right before you.

i vote NOT NOT NOT

At 6:42 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

But you are right on the turkey, Bob Hull is still around.

At 9:50 PM, Blogger Not Larry Sabato said...

The Libby Garvey sexual references should stop. No more "Hot or Not" please. It's distracting from the good stuff going on in this discussion.

At 7:21 PM, Blogger Not Larry Sabato said...

Annon- I'd rather not endanger our source on this one.

At 3:10 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Fine NLS.

Final Tally: 3 Hot, 5 Not.

I'm a little disapointed the electorate doesn't know what a great looking woman looks like!

At 10:47 AM, Anonymous Kevin Beekman said...

Come on 'Not Larry', it's been a few days...where are these press reports and mailings? If you can't come up with them, you should withdraw this post. Either that or change your name to 'Not Reputable'.

But congratulations on elevating the level of discourse. What a great forum you have made for annonymous innuendo, unsubstantiated rumor and puerile speculation!

And congratulations to the Englins (and FOEs) for their 'progressive' leadership in promoting it. They deserve the credit for taking campaigning to the high-tech gutter.

At 1:23 PM, Blogger Not Larry Sabato said...

We never said the press had a report on this. Mandala mentioned it in one debate, and a source of ours got a mailing. That's all we know..

At 4:55 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I hear Jim Lay is going to GOP voters as their most "moderate" choice. Will the Dems attack each other enough, and divide and narrow the vote so the GOP can pick Lay?

It's happened before...

At 5:24 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I doubt any GOP members in the 45th choose the Democrat's ballot on June 14. They have an Attorney General and Lt. Governor nominee to pick. So the chances of them giving that choice up are slim. Jim Lay should move to somewhere in Fairfax where he would be a tremendous candidate in a split district.

At 5:57 PM, Anonymous GopAlex said...

Jim will win this primary. The Republicans know their vote won't change the statewide races, but that their vote can mean a lot for Delegate. I can't wait to vote for Lay and watch the Democrats cry as another seat moves RIGHT!

At 9:10 PM, Anonymous Kristina M. said...

I'd been considering Laura Mandala (though leaning against her, in truth) but congratulations, Kevin Beekman, you've convinced me to scratch her off the short list.

If her supporters are as ill-tempered, mean spirited, and irrational as you, then I surely don't want to be counted among them.

Do your girl a favor and lay off the Englins. It just makes you, and her, look small.

At 10:40 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Hey, lay off of Kevin Beekman! He's not running for office. He has as much right to say what he thinks as Shayna Englin does.

I've already scratched the Englins off of my short list. And, too bad for that. I was pulling for them in the very beginning because I liked the fact that their son goes to one of our wonderful public schools. But Shayna's negative comments about Mandala (on this blog) really turned me off. I don't care how tired and stressed she was at the time.

I expect the negative stuff from supporters, but not the candidate's wife!!

I will say this though, the only candidates who have literally been at my door are Englin, Mandala and Garvey. Where are the other three? If they want me to consider them on June 14th, they better start knocking - I haven't made up my mind yet!

At 10:55 PM, Blogger Not Larry Sabato said...

Is there any major issue the candidates would vote different on?

At 11:07 PM, Anonymous Daryl said...

Beekman's jabs at Ms. Englin are worse than anything she's said on this blog. I've personally heard Mandala say worse about all of the other candidates.

If you are really prepared to make a decision in this race based on what the candidate's spouse says in a comment on a blog, then you deserve whatever representation you end up with. I would have thought the voters in the 45th were more thoughtful than that, but it explains a lot that they're evidently not.

At 11:32 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

In response to Daryl - well, if the truth be known, I like Libby Garvey the best and find her to be the most qualified. But, I'd really like to see someone from Alexandria get elected. So, I'm holding out hope that one of the remaining three - Lay, Mosqueda and Hobson - will appear at my door so that I can talk to them face-to-face.

Regarding Ms. Englin's comments, I disagree with you. I found her comments inappropriate.

I haven't been exposed to the "personal" comments you claim to have heard directly from Laura Mandala, so I can't comment on those.

So, as it stands now - with me, anyway, Libby seems to have the edge. She's got a lot of support here in Alexandria (more than people realize).

At 12:19 AM, Anonymous Daryl said...

Anonymous Libby supporter:

So here's what we know about you. You make decisions based on stupid things, like what a candidate's wife does or does not say on a blog.

And you are not courageous enough in your convictions to put even your first name on them.

With supporters like you and Beekman, Libby and Laura must be so proud! No wonder the Democratic party is going down the tubes.

At 12:42 AM, Anonymous kerry d said...

i think i heard there is some separation on gay marriage-whether or not to call it marriage or otherwise; also some separation on whether or not to withdraw from no child left behind;

imho, englin is great on both. he was the strongest voice for marriage equality; and he and lay are the only ones calling for va to withdraw from nclb. so lay gets some points there.

outside of that there is very little room on the issues that i've seen but sometimes people only see what they want to see. anyone care to remove the wool from my eyes?

At 10:40 AM, Anonymous Kevin Beekman said...

Excuse my low tolerance for BS. I guess I shouldn't post when I'm hungover.

And excuse my desire to set the facts straight. 'Not Larry' originally said that Ms. Mandala was going negative on Ms. Garvey by "telling the press", but there have been no press reports.

Now he's said that Ms. Mandala's statements were made at a candidate forum, but the issues related to the new high school only began to grow (in the newspaper reports at least) since the last candidate forum.

'Not Larry' has also talked about sources who have received mailings from Ms. Mandala on this same subject. My 'sources', however, say that no such mailing exists. And none of my contacts have reported receiving any such mailing.

I'd just like to know what's what. Can someone please produce one of these mailings?

At 11:35 AM, Anonymous Tim said...

Beekman, you're not reading as a guy with a low tolerance for BS. You're reading like a guy with an axe to grind.

Interesting, too, that your hangover is your excuse for your behavior but exhaustion and stress (and genuine competition) aren't good enough excuses for Ms. Englin, in your book.

At 11:49 AM, Anonymous Tim said...

Incidentally, I got yet another recorded phone call from Laura. Evidently her neice has a hard time reading and now she's decided we're teaching to tests, and that's bad. At least, I think she thinks that's bad.

I wonder what in her background or present has led her to that conclusion, given that she neither attended nor has any children in VA public schools. Nor any policy background.

It would be great to ask her, but the recording just yammers on and on. Have I mentioned how much I hate getting calls from machines?

At 11:55 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

NLS, I have heard the same thing about Mandala using that. But I have not seen a mailpiece. Did you hear from someone that got it, or did you hear from someone who heard about it?

At 12:14 PM, Blogger Not Larry Sabato said...

I heard from someone who heard about it. Kevin, you should have just said that from the start instead of asking me about my source, if the information is incorrect, I will correct it. Now that you said that, I will look into whether this mail piece exists.

At 12:43 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Beekman - every single time a candidate calls the press, they run with it. Right? So Mandala couldn't possibly be calling the press on this if the peerless Annie Gowan hasn't seen fit to write anything on it! How silly of us to doubt you!

At 2:59 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I feel bad for Beekman- got to hold your alcohol better buddy. And if you still have a buzz- dont waste on a House of Delegates blog!

At 5:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Has anyone noticed that Jim Lay's signs don't have "Democrat" on them? Is this a sign that he really is a Republican and may consider jumping over to the other side if he loses the primary?

Say what you want about the others - Englin, Mandala and Garvey - but at least they're proud to be "Democrats."

At 5:05 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I've seen no real debate here on Mosqueda and Hobson.

I know both are long-time Alexandria residents and Alexandria Democratic Party faithfuls. I know Hobson has had this job before, but I'm not sure that he's cut out for the 21st century? He doesn't even have a website?

What's everyone's take on them?

At 5:09 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Topic of Elsie:

As Libby once said so well:

"Every Delegate gets an assistant. The 45th District doesn't need one in the Delegate's office also".

At 5:42 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...


At 6:32 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Between Libby, Elsie, Laura and Shayna this has been the biggest catfight ever!

At 10:59 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Hmm, Englin, Garvey, or Mandala likely to win? Too bad I don't like any of them. Englin (Harvard elitist, how long has he lived here for again?), Garvey (aka school district lady lol), or Mandala (does money make you a good candidate?). I still have hope for Mosqueda or Lay though, especially Mosqueda b/c we need to build alliances with other powerful Dems like Brian Moran to get anywhere in Richmond where things aren't so pretty for us.

At 11:36 AM, Anonymous Genevieve said...

“Harvard elitist”? Yes indeed, let’s try and trash a person’s reputation because they were fortunate and intelligent enough to be able to attend a prestigious school. As someone who has met and worked with David, I will tell you right now that he is the least “elite” person I have ever met. When I first met David, he was the only candidate that I have met that was willing to actually talk to me, a high school student. He didn’t just stand there and push his campaign at me either- he was genuinely interested in what I had to say, and the political organization that I run. How is going to a good school a bad thing? I fail to see the logic. Let’s trash a person based on… intelligence. Let’s stereotype about Harvard students. Yes. They are all awful human beings. They hate other people. They are elitist snobs. They are, heaven forbid, intelligent. Harvard students are terrible. Don’t go to Harvard because you will emerge as a terrible human being, incapable of making any descision, and a constant broken leg, gained from tripping while looking down your nose constantly.

See, that doesn’t sound like the Harvard people I know (and I know four, two students, two grads). Y’know, that doesn’t even sound like the Oxford guy I know. It doesn’t sound like yale, it doesn’t sound like Princeton, it doesn’t sound remotely Ivy League. It definitely does not sound like David. It does sound ignorant though.

Elitist? No. Elitist is brushing off someone who wants to talk to you because they are in high school, or because they aren’t voting in the election. Elitist is believing that you are right and everyone else is wrong- and when the person you are talking to tries to explain their credentials, speaking patronizingly to them. Elitist is demeaning the contributions others have made on a volunteer basis. I have had of these experiences with candidates- the brush off with Jim Lay, the patronization from Libby Garvey, and the demeaning comments from Laura Mandala.

This is not me being negative, or starting a “catfight.” I, as a high school student, deserve to be listened to just as much as anyone else, and if I can get that respect as well as a great campaign with a clear definition of both the issues and the plans to solve the issues from a “Harvard elitist” then I will and do.

That’s right. David Englin. If you feel the need to trash talk a candidate, at least know what you’re talking about.

And it is a sad, sad day when the so called mature, ethical, adults who know so much about the world have to hear it from those lazy teenagers who are supposedly apathetic about anything except MTV.

At 11:38 AM, Anonymous Genevieve said...

Argh! NotLarry, can you do something about the freakish multiple post that happened?

(I'm at school currently and using a proxy, I guess that's might have something to do with it... I really have no idea and sincerely apologize for the multiple post)

At 11:46 AM, Blogger Not Larry Sabato said...

Genevieve- Sure. Good post. We're glad to see you involved.

At 12:21 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Harvard servers having problems Ms Gen?

At 6:54 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

If you can't keep your cool about a small Harvard comment then you don't belong in politics. Anyway I have seen David speak twice already and I don't like him. If he gets elected, he will use the position as a stepping-stool, then move onto something better right away. I believe politicans should be committed to serving an area, perferably for most of their lives as long as they are doing a good job. It's something called sacrifice. True change in politics come from long term work by building a political base, keeping party loyality - no matter what, and through alliances.

At 7:04 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Englin is no Van Landingham

At 11:20 PM, Anonymous VADem said...

Where did you get that he wants to use the seat as a stepping stool? Is that what he means by saying he wants to stay in the seat to use the safe seat to build the VA Dem party?
And ...other anon... what qualifies you to tell a HS girl that is getting involved in politics that she doesnt belong?

At 11:45 AM, Anonymous vacharlieboy said...

Holy smokes. This discussion has become more gossippy then my ant's at Christmas.

What is needed to win this race: money, mavens, message and organization, and probably a little bit of luck. Here is my rundown:

Mosqueda: Competitive on money, but looking between the lines, she has not demonstrated she can raise money (but with Moran behind her should be able to); same thing on the mavens with Moran: but no evidence there yet; NO ORGANIZATION OR MESSAGE

Mandala: Lots of boyfriend's money, if she can use it well, which she has not so we will go with NO MAVENS, message is developing but not there yet, and NO ORGANIZATION



Garvey: Competitive on Money; She changed campaign managers midstream, so maybe on the Maven now; Message is not consistent; Organization is struggling

Englin: Competitive on Money; Has someone with a sense of strategy behind the scenes (maybe the Mrs.) so a probably on the Maven, Has the best and most articulated message and most certainly has the organization

My preference is public for those of you who read regularly; but I encourage others to prove me wrong on any of the above.

At 5:18 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I know for a fact that Laura Mandala has not attacked anyone in the mail. Only one of her mail pieces has been mailed and it was purely a bio piece. These attacks on Mandala's character are fictional

At 5:21 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

How can you attack a character when someone doesnt have one

At 5:22 PM, Anonymous Sharon Broughton said...

Good god, Laura freaks - move along.

VACharlieBoy makes a great argument. Anyone have anything of substance to say in response?

I agree with him. Attacks or no attacks, Mandala is still a weak candidate. Four weeks is an eternity in politics, but VACharlieBoy is right on for where things stand right now. Englin is the candidate to beat.

At 5:26 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Englin's email today said that he got the local Deaniac endorsement. He looks like a juggernaught right now. The other candidates have got to pick up some buzz. The same old group of blue-hairs just isn't going to cut it this time.

At 6:39 PM, Blogger Not Larry Sabato said...

OK, I do have a few sources confirming that Mandala mentioned the W+L thing at some forum(s).

I can not get a second confirmation on the mail piece. My GOP source did not get this one, and after all this discussion, frankly I'm scared of everyone who lives in this district. So I haven't made a lot more calls. Until I can get a second source on this, I'll withdrawl the comment on the mail piece.

At 9:25 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

An interesting article:

Fight for the 45th
New boundaries and big shoes to fill in the race for delegate.
By Stefan Cornibert
The Arlington Connection
May 19, 2005

Candidates for Marian Van Landingham's seat in the 45th District will have to contend with more than just each other for the coveted seat in Richmond. The newly redrawn district is more diverse than ever, with voters in a broad range of social and economic demographics. Combined with what some expect to be a low turnout at the polls, the district's new make up means it could be anyone's race.
"Within the city of Alexandria there's going to be a major split," Van Landingham said Thursday at her Cameron Street home after returning from a stay in the hospital brought on by symptoms related to her ongoing battle with cancer. "I think a lot of people still see the district as a strictly Alexandria one, but it isn't like that anymore."
An artist and outspoken community activist, Van Landingham has held the 45th District seat since 1981, but her health led her to announce in December of 2004 that she will not seek another term. Leaving some very big shoes for her successor to fill, Van Landingham said the new boundaries of the district — now with 13 precincts in Alexandria, six in Fairfax County and three in Arlington — will play a key role in deciding who takes the seat. Chances are high for Arlington School Board Chairwoman Libby Garvey. Although Garvey is a relative newcomer to Alexandria politics, Van Landingham said, she has gained key endorsements from Democratic leaders in Mt. Vernon and is already well known in the Arlington precincts. With 40 percent of the district now outside Alexandria, Van Landingham said Garvey could take the race by leveraging that support. Van Landingham stressed that she will not endorse or condemn any candidate. Van Landingham said former delegate Dick Hobson could also fare well, but she has seen little indication of his popularity compared to the other five Democrats in the race.
"Certainly, he has a good chance," she said. "He's been elected before and he's an awfully nice guy."
Van Landingham is a big believer in the idea a candidate needs to develop a track record in the local community before running for office. For that reason, she questioned whether the timing is right for candidates David Englin and Laura Mandala.
"David is a very nice young man but he hasn't been around very long," she said, pointing out that he only became active in local politics during the November 2004 elections. "It's unusual to have someone who hasn't paid their community dues to turn around and run for office."
Van Landingham — who worked with Rep. Jim Moran (D-8) both during his tenure as mayor of Alexandria and in the U.S. House — also questioned Englin's role in Andy Rosenberg's 2004 Democratic campaign for Congress. A significant segment of his support, she said, comes from Democrats dissatisfied with Moran's leadership.
As for Mandala, Van Landingham credited her role on Alexandria's Women's Commission but noted that she moved into the district to run for the 45th seat. Mandala's campaign financing, she said, is also telling. According to state finance records, the bulk of Mandala's campaign money, $57,000, comes from her longtime friend Edward Spoden.
"That's really strange," Van Landingham said. "It doesn't show that she has community support."
Candidate and prosecutor Jim Lay, she said, is also a new face. Although Lay has involved himself in community work related to affordable housing, Van Landingham said he's a former Republican.
"And sometimes he sounds more like he's running for prosecutor than for delegate," she said.
Van Landingham declined to say much about candidate and aide to Del. Brain Moran Elsie Mosqueda because it was Van Landingham's aide who schooled Mosqueda in the early stages of her political career.
But voter turnout, Van Landingham said, is the real challenge in the coming election. For the district, she said, 35 to 40 percent turnout is high, and this election could only see about 20 or 30 percent.
"It's really going to come down to the precinct workers and how many supporters each candidate can get to the polls," Van Landingham said. "Voter turnout is the great imponderable in all this."
She added that, although many of the candidates are running mail campaigns, there is question as to whether those leaflets will do much to sway any new voters into action.
A look at the 2000 census shows broad diversity in the district's voting population. In the new Arlington precincts and those in Fairfax County, Latinos account for nearly a quarter of the voting populace. Upper middle-class voters make up the majority, with the median household income ranging from about $52,000 to $58,000. The median age spans between 33 and 36, with a higher percentage of older voters in the Alexandria contingent. Most voters in the 45th are also college-educated, accounting for one-third to one-half of the total in each region.
If election records are any indication, the district also has some significant political divisions. The last time Van Landingham was on the ballot, the November 2003 election when she faced off against Rob Jay Test, she won by a very wide but not overwhelming majority. In Fairfax County, Test took 1,170 votes to Van Landingham's 2,052. In Arlington, she took 1,279 votes to Test's 611. And in Alexandria, Test won 2,938 votes to her 4,960. Van Landingham said that because of the current gubernatorial race, she believes Republicans chose not to field a candidate because of the higher percentage of Democrats expected at the polls.
When it comes to the race for her seat, she said, it is anyone's game.
"It's a variety of people with many different skills and many different ideas," she said.

At 10:33 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Interesting in that it shows that Van Landingham has no idea what she's talking about.

There is no way on god's green earth there will be 20% turnout in this election.

Dick Hobson does not have a chance in hell of winning.

And she seems to say that direct mail doesn't make a difference. Ask Adam Ebbin if that's true.

It also shows that just because she's dying doesn't mean she's not petty. The crack on Lay was unfair, and her slight on Elsie was just mean.

At 11:36 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

For some reason, the Alexandria knitting circle is aflitter with Garvey. If they had any influence, Lois Walker would still be on the Council.

I thought Van Landingham had more class than this. These were not comments that just slipped out.

At 1:17 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Because they are petrified of change.

It's time for the old people to move aside. They have presided over an amazing decline in our Party. Time for new leadership. Clearly the same old way of doing things isn't working. Maybe it never did.

I was leaning toward Englin. Now I'm solid.

At 3:15 PM, Blogger Not Larry Sabato said...

I was just getting ready to post that. I'll put it up on the front page.

At 7:38 PM, Anonymous G-eve said...

Wow, you get busy for a week and...

Anon- Sorry, don't know the state of the Harvard servers, being that I am still in High School. Not college. HS. I could call my friend, except he just got home, so I don't think he knows. I assume they're just fine though. Don't lose any sleep.

Anon II- oops! You're so right. I don't belong in politics- I'd better go back and watch some more Family Guy or MTV or something. Except...then my brain cells would rot and I'd die. And, despite my occasional old age crack, it is something I aspire to, the alternatives being what they are.

You all should note though, that according to the Alexandria Dems website (, Laura and Dick aren't running anymore. I told (emailed) both today, so by the time some people click, it may have changed.

At 3:27 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...


How was the UNethical forum?

At 4:34 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

The Alex Dem page is still wrong. The folks in charge over there are so used to having it their way, they just decided to eliminate a couple of candidates! Tomorrow you may see just one name on the site--Libby, of course, who seems to be their chosen one. I agree that they are scared of new blood. But by their logic ("XXX hasn't been here long enough..."; "so-and-so hasn't paid their dues"), why isn't Richard Hobson their favorite? He's got Libby beat in the seniority department by at least ten years or so.

At 11:19 AM, Anonymous G-eve said...

Awww… Anon, that’s so sweet of you to care! Now, of course, it would help to know who you are- did you go? You should have, cause it was a party and a half. Let’s see, we had on our panel : Brian Moran, Libby Garvey, Patsy Ticer, Ms. Herring, who is Laura’s legal counsel, people from local businesses (such as accounting managers and printers from Corporate Press), Adam Ebbin, and also, David gave a short speech at the beginning before he had to leave. The panel had some great discussions, and the moderator was superb, if I don’t say so myself.  Anywho, I’d actually say that
a. it was ethical (not political, not business oriented, but ethical)
b. it was very sweet of people who originally said they couldn’t come to be able to change their plans at the last minute, and I appreciate it more than they could know (look for your thank you emails and Libby, I owe you a gift, which I’ll email about…)
c. This is soooo not a blog about my personal life. If you want to bother me about my personal life or my club, don’t do it through NLS’s blog. Really. My life is not that important. Now, since you are being anonymous, yet know about my ethical panel discussion, I assume you got the infamous email. However, I don’t really care to discuss that right now- if you went, you know how it went. If you didn’t go, then do you need to know? No. I will tell you that it was a major success, but the personal details of my life don’t concern you. :P

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At 4:01 AM, Blogger Personal Development said...

I am sure you have heard the song "Karma Chameleon" by Culture Club but have you ever given much thought to its meaning? While on Earth, you are living in a world of reincarnation which is governed by the law of karma. Karma begins to propel you as Soul on a personal journey through the universe. Karma ends when you have reached enlightenment and fully realise that this physical reality and the Universe itself is just an illusion. When you reach a state of knowingness that there is but One all pervading essence and that essence or consciousness is You!
So what is Karma and how does it work? While in the illusion you have a soul. This soul lives past, present, and future lives. To grow in love, joy, and awareness, you reincarnate into a series of physical bodies to experience different existences. This road leads to the experiences of being both sexes, all races, religions, and ethnic types throughout many lifetimes.
Karma in its simplicist terms can be described by the biblical statement "as you sow, so also shall you reap". Karma is the principle of cause and effect, action and reaction, total cosmic justice and personal responsibility. It brings 'good' experiences as well as 'bad' - a debt must be repaid and a blessing rewarded.

A more indepth esoteric look at karma gives us the following distinctions: Sanchita Karma: the accumulated result of all your actions from all your past lifetimes. This is your total cosmic debt. Every moment of every day either you are adding to it or you are reducing this cosmic debt. Prarabdha Karma: the portion of your "sanchita" karma being worked on in the present life. If you work down your agreed upon debt in this lifetime, then more past debts surface to be worked on. Agami Karma: the portion of actions in the present life that add to your "sanchita" karma. If you fail to work off your debt, then more debts are added to "sanchita" karma and are sent to future lives. Kriyamana Karma: daily, instant karma created in this life that is worked off immediately. These are debts that are created and worked off - ie. you do wrong, you get caught and you spend time in jail.
As a soul, you experience a constant cycle of births and deaths with a series of bodies for the purpose of experiencing this illusionary world gaining spiritual insights into your own true nature until the totality of all experiences show you Who you really are - the I AM! Until you have learned, you will find that pretending that the rules of karma do not exist or trying to escape the consequences of your actions is futile.
Although it may often "feel" like punishment, the purpose of karma is to teach not to punish. Often the way we learn is to endure the same type of suffering that we have inflicted on others and also rexperience circumstances until we learn to change our thinking and attitudes.

We are all here to learn lessons as spiritual beings in human form. These lessons are designed to help us grow into greater levels of love, joy, and awareness. They teach us our true nature of love. Where we do not choose love, show forgiveness, teach tolerance, or display compassion, karma intervenes to put us back on the path of these lessons. Quite simply, the only way to achieve a state of karmic balance is to be love.
Before you incarnated into your present personality, you agreed to put yourself in the path of all that is you need to learn. Once you got here, you agreed to forget this. Karma is impersonal and has the same effect for everyone. It is completely fair in its workings and it is predictable - "do onto others as you would have them do unto you" is a way to ensure peace and tranquillity in your own life as well as the lives of those you come into contact with. The law of karma is predictable - "as you sow, so shall you reap" what is done to you is the net result of what you have done to others!
Karma gives you the opportunity at every moment to become a better person than you are and to open up to the realization that you are the master of your own fate.

The goal of karma is to give you all the experiences that you need to evolve into greater levels of love, joy, awareness, and responsibility. Karma teaches that you are totally responsible for the circumstances of your life. They keep you on the straight and narrow until you have mastered your vehicle and can ride freely on your own. Once you understand that you are the master of your own circumstances and that everything you experience is a direct result of your past actions due to your thinking and emotional responses you can overcome its seeming negative effects by creating only 'good' karma.
Karma forces us to look beyond ourselves (oneness) so that we can see ourselves as we truly are Whole, Complete, at One with everything. Once we truly understand ourselves, we can see our divinity and our unity with all life.
Karma drives us to service. Love means service. Once you accept total responsibility for your life, you see yourself as a soul in service to God. Once you do, you become a fully realized being, allowing God to experience the illusion through you.
Belief in karma and an understanding of its workings will lead you to a life of bliss. Only your own deeds can hinder you. Until the time comes when we release ourselves from our own self-imposed shackles of limitation and fully understand who and what we are we will live under the mantle of karma. So until that day why not create some wonderful experiences for ourselves by "doing onto others, as we would have them do unto us". personal development

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